Just to name two:
1. he is in fact a good person, but he is cursed (the curse of the Dark One). as seen, before he actually got the powers he wanted them so that he could end the Ogre Wars and innocent people die no more.
2. even as the Dark One, he created the curse out of love, for the thing he loved the most: his son. Gina on the other hand caste the curse out of love for herself, because she wanted to be happy, and in her egoism even killed the thing she loved the most, her father, to be happy.
Really hard to say. I went with Gina because Gold made her what she is. He pretty much planned it the seer told him he was gonna get someone else to cast this dark curse. So he took an innocent girl, bought her hopes up and crushed them. Despite his good motives it was very selfish. I would not be surprised to hear that he had manipulated Cora into killing Dan. The one Gina loved, whom she cast the curse for. Gold and Gina have similar motives both based on love; fact of the matter is perhaps Gina wouldn't have to have the motives had her mom not killed her love and Gold not pushed her over the edge.
There's also the fact that he was around longer as the dark one, which gave him plenty more time to do those little evil deeds.Such as turning men into bugs, exploding faeries, beating the crap out of people, and destroying shops.
Despite Belle begging him to stop he continued to violently beat Hook and destroy all the things in his shop and many other things.
And let's not forget, he looked like he was gonna beat Emma to if Neal hadn't shown up.
I don't understand how some people seem to have blinders on when it comes to all the wrong doings of Rumple. They somehow find all his horrid actions justifiable but when it come to Regina she's just a 'monster'. I don't deny Regina has done terrible or even unforgivable things but Rumple is just as bad if not worse than she is.
I agree with zanhar1, lets not forget that Rumple had a hand in pushing Regina into her darkened spiral of revenge.
It surprises me to see how people are so blind when it comes to complexity and see things in a narrow way. So as to say that if one considers a character an epic villain, well built, complex, with a fascinating story, with a mesmerizing personality etc. , that one person is justifying and tries to make the EPIC villain a saint.
Just one more reason - out of the hundreds- why, though also a bad guy, Gold is a better person than gina:
3. He used his powers to do good too. As in stopping the Ogre Wars. And that came out of his soul, and not because he wanted to impress somebody.
HE HAS BEEN EVIL MUCH LONGER THAN HER, PLUS HE WANTED POWER BUT SHE NEVER TO BEGIN WITH, HE WAS THE ONE WHO MADE HER WHAT SHE IS. I AGREE SHE HAS DONE LOTS OF BAD THINGS BUT HE HAS BEEN EVIL LONGER THAN HER, SO ONE WOULD ASSUME HE HAS DONE MORE BAD THINGS.
(SORRY MY CAPS LOCK IS STUCK IT WON''T COME OFF LOL)
I don't understand how some people seem to have blinders on when it comes to all the wrong doings of Rumple. They somehow find all his horrid actions justifiable but when it come to Regina she's just a 'monster'. I don't deny Regina has done terrible or even unforgivable things but Rumple is just as bad if not worse than she is.
I know right. People set up these huge double standards, not just on this site either. And deny that hey do. Rumple and Gina have both done some pretty crappy things. Both have also done really good things. For instance, Snow wouldn't even be alive now if not for Gina; she save Snow twice (once when Cora hexed her horse and once when Rumple put a killing curse on the portal they were about to come through).
I know right. Not everyone can understand subtle differences in the building of a character.
Another reason for which Gold, though also a bad guy, is a better person:
4. He does good deeds and does not boost about it, nor switch back to evil mode in one second just because the others don't rush to acknowledge his merits.
Like the fact that he gave the amulet to Henry, willing to pay himself the price for such powerful magic. And when the next day the Charmings with no proof at all came and accused him of murdering Archie he didn't go all evil and vengeful, but treated them with humor ^_^
Her and Gold are much the same. Many people say he's better because he is ''The Beast'' in a story, well he is no better then The Evil Queen.
That's why i picked Regina.
Ok. Your opinion.
I think Regina is better villain, because i've seen her in action many times (casting a curse, traveling to Wonderland, tricking people and now searching for a dagger) and also resembless to disney version of EQ.
Yes not many do see the subtle differences in the building of a character. Some seem to fail to see through there biases that the characters are both well and complexly built in differing ways. I'm not Gold's biggest fan but at least I can look past that bias and see he's a well built character.
Gina doesn't boast about her good deeds. Neither of them do. Perhaps Rumple never went back to being evil in one second because he never truly started on his road to redemption either. People say Gina wasn't really trying because she had only told Henry she was sorry (which is not true she apologized to Emma as well), well I haven't heard Gold say sorry to anyone but Belle. He never even vocally confirmed that he was trying to change. Another point I would like to make is that Gina didn't flop back to the evil side because her deeds went unacknowledged, (maybe such was a factor) but the reason she went back to being evil is because she was accused of murder, with that false accusation she may as well have still been evil. Gold didn't go all evil because he was able to prove he wasn't the killer, and his mother did not frame him. Again he didn't go evil again because he still hasn't really begun his road to redemption in the first place, by the standards you seem to hold for Gina anyways. Those standards being; Gina doesn't want to be good she just wants Henry, well Gold doesn't want to be good or give up magic he just wants Belle. And Gina isn't trying to be good because she only apologized to Henry and not the others she hurt. Same goes for Gold, he only apologized to Belle.
Not to mention almost killing Snow and Emma isn't exactly what someone on the good side would do. Nor is beating the crap out of Hook (though he had it coming) either. And at least Gina was able to hold out on her promise to Henry not to use magic (Gold couldn't manage that for Belle).
@zanhar1 You make a very interesting point and it makes me think...
That is probably why it's so much easier to write off Rumps evil deeds then Gina's. He is who he is and he doesn't pretend to be any thing other than evil. He never make promises he cant keep (except to Belle and Bae) and he's always clear about the price for his services from the start. All this gives the impression that anyone that becomes involved with him and knows who he is are just asking for it. Gina is less strait forward in her evilness she gets people to trust her and then she turns on them. It feels more personal and less like business.
Still I don't think being more truthful about your evil intentions necessarily makes you a better person. That's like saying a mob boss is a better person then a con-man. They are both bad people. Anyway I picked Gina because she honestly tried to change. Rumple is trying too but it never felt like he was trying quite as hard as Gina was; he was still using magic, he never showed regret for what he had done in the past, ect.
Exactly, most people seem to write off Rumple's wrong doings because he's up front about it and viewers are a tad used to it.
Again, exactly, In fact I would think it makes him more evil, as it almost creates a sense that he takes pride in his evils. Which is backed by the fact that he uses his magic to make people fear him, which is pretty much taking pride in an evil action he committed. And once again well put, I agree.
I actually don't think one is worse than the other.
Rumple was cursed.
Regina made an actual attempt to change and redeem herself.
Rumple originally the Dark One to stop the Ogre Wars so Bae wouldn't have to go fight.
Regina originally started working with Rumple to protect herself from her mother, and to find a way to bring Daniel back.
Rumple being cursed only excuses so much of his behavior.
Regina's pain only excuses so much of her behavior.
If I actually sat down and tallied it all up, and then scratched off certain tallies for certain excuses, they'd actually come out pretty even.
I so with you @bri-marie if this were question I'd vote you best answer. I actually did a tally here:
link
and it was very close. (Scroll to the bottom if you just want the summery)
Another reason why, though also a bad guy, Gold is a better person than gina:
5. Rumps went from selfless love to selfish love (he preferred to rip Milah's heart better than to let her be happy with Hook after all she had done to him), then again to SELFLESS love (As seen first in Skin Deep -> he would rather let Belle go, though he loved her, than keep her next to him - because he thought he could not make her happy).
On the other hand gina went from love (Daniel) to taking advantages and abusing others love for her (like Sidney) to selfish love (she would rather rip Graham's heart out than let him be happy with the one he loved).
so, Gold evolved to good, gina just went from bad to worse considering this aspect. Again, Gold, though also a bad guy, is better than the one he's compared to.
Actually both Gina and Rumps have gone through the process you described.
Step 1: selfless love
Gina - Daniel
Rumple - Milah
Step 2: using someones love for them
Gina - Genie
Rumple - Cora? (this is strongly suggested but we won't know for sure until The Millers Daughter. Even if it's not true Rumps has manipulated enough people to make up for it.)
Step 3: selfish love
Gina - Graham
Rumple - Milah
Step 4: selfless love again
Gina - yet to be determined (Gina hasn't found her "Belle" yet unless you count Henry who she let live with the Charming because he wasn't happy with her.)
Rumple - Belle
gina was already evil, before she met Rumps. Remember her line related to Snow: "I should have let her die."
Related to my previous reason: I see people don't really care about Graham. In as counting him as 'love' for gina. Then if she killed a guy she was just having sex with because he found somebody who loved him, and whom he loved... than makes her even a worse person.
And let's not bring Cora in yet. From what I've got out of Rose's description of her character it was that sort of relationship in which they've both used each other. So let's not talk without knowing.
Another reason why, though also a bad guy, Gold is a better person than gina:
5. He didn't kill anyone in his Storybrooke life, as Mr. Gold.
gina killed Graham.
I don't believe Gina was completely evil at that point; to say something is different from doing it. There are many times when I regretted helping a person because it backfired on me, I don't think that makes me evil. If I have my timeline correct, after saying that she seemed to forget about it all for a while. She was, at that time, trying to escape her mother or bring her lover back more than anything else. And it wasn't until Rumple rose her hopes up of getting Dan back and then crushing them that things took a turn for the worse. On top of that the real change didn't set in until he told her she wasn't serious about doing magic for not wanting to crush a heart. She felt like she had to prove him wrong, and that's when the evil queen was born. I would also like to note that costuming is a huge indicator of a character's personality; it wasn't until after she met Rumple that her cloths became darker and indicated a personality change.
Counting Graham is Gina's lover is not, not careing about Graham. He was a love intrest for her until Emma came into the picture. In Storybrook it is a fact that Graham agreed to have sex with her (as shown when he came to her house that night, kissing her, claiming 'I need to feel something'). Again with the double standards; Rumple clearly had sex with Milah (considering Bae is alive) and he had no problem ripping her heart out when she found someone who loved her, and that she loved back. It's the same thing both Gold and Gina were cheated on and both gave the same response. They are equally as bad in that light. Not one murder is worse than another. And in this case not one is more 'justifiable' than the other, as it was the exact same thing (motives and way of murder in all). So if that makes Gina a worse person, what does the very same action make Rumple?
But it's still a possibility. Gold and Cora did have some relationship and I would not be surprised at all if it was just based on Rumple's plan to find his son and not true love.
Not true, in his Storybrook life he had attempted to kill three people; Hook, Snow, and Emma. The only reason he didn't was because someone was there to inter-vine each time. If Belle didn't tell him to stop he would've beat Hook to death. If Regina didn't absorb the curse he cast on the well Snow and Emma'd be gone as well. In fact he tried to kill (or at least harm) Emma again, who knows what would've happened if Neal didn't barge in. The only thing that kept him from murder in Storybrook were people butting in. As a side note turned Smee into a mouse (I think it was a mouse), pushed him over the border, and threatened his life on multiple occasions.
Honestly they did the same thing, one evil deed isn't any kinder or nicer than another. As minavaradawn pointed out (in both her comment and well, written, bias free article) if you tally up each good and bad thing both characters have done, they are about even in evilness.
He defiantly didn't double cross Bae when he let him fall to New York. And it clearly wasn't double crossing Regina when he helped Emma prove Snow innocent despite assuring Regina that he'd make sure Snow was gonna be found guilty.
You keep saying they're both evil. but you still picked gina as better, right?
As Mr. Gold said from the moment he lost Bae he never failed to keep another deal. That was a turning point in his life. It changed him forever. Because he's complex like that: he learns from past mistakes.
Another reason why, though also a bad guy, Gold is a better person than gina:
7.Rumps didn't send kids to their deaths. It takes a special kind of awful to do stuff like that. I don’t know how anyone could reach the point where feeding kids to a cannibal doesn't bother them at all.
^When Bae was lost in that hole, it was RUMPEL'S FAULT. HE CHOSE MAGIC INSTEAD OF HIM, IN THAT MOMENT.
And he killed his ex wife and Bae's mother (doesn't matter how bitchy she was, no one deserves that), he wanted for Regina to lose her soul (that is worse then death), also he killed his female servent and he killed Cionderella's godmother and that guy he 1st turned into snail.
Not to mention he turned Regina evil... For God sake, it wasn't Regina's fault becasue he lost his son. It was his. Really curios how Bae will react when he hears about these actions.
I picked Gina simply because there was no both are just as evil option, and I have voted on every pick on this spot thus far and don't plan on changing that, it is a very OCDish thing I have on fanpop. But he has failed to keep a deal or made some loophole in the deal, which in my mind is still breaking a deal, or not even making it in the first place.
Rumple had treated the seer pretty unkindly when she was a caged up little girl he got mad at her for speaking the truth and started yelling at her and what not. Gold tried to steal Cindy's baby, it takes a special kind of awful to steal an unborn baby in both Storybrook and Fairytale land. Gold could've found Hansel and Gretel a home as he was the landlord of Storybrook, he chose not to. Again both committed the same evil but in a different way.
And as magichand bought up; he wanted to rip Regina's soul away. I don't know if you are similar with Harry Potter, but in that world losing one's soul is considered worse than death itself. Gina never tried to steal someone's soul.
I'm not saying number 5 isnt true just that it only shows how similar they are. Put aside the fact that we all love gramhan so much and hate milah. Imagine you liked them both equally. If you look at it this way the deed comiting is essentially the same. A person they had feeling for found someone else they loved more and they killed them rather then let them be happy.
@minervadawn that was EXACTLY my point. Rumps killing Milah is (almost) the same as Gina killing Graham. BUT Rumps has evolved from that moment to SELFLESS love: his love for Belle. Gina is still at selfish love -----> which makes Rumps a better person.
seriously... if you don't even read my comments.. at least don't reply to them.
and if you all say they're the same: why pick gina as better? I don't see you with no variant chosen - because you can't make the difference between them. you still picked gina.
Gina did selflessly love Henry. She clearly did read your comments as she responded to the same thing with this answer; Actually both Gina and Rumps have gone through the process you described.
Step 1: selfless love
Gina - Daniel
Rumple - Milah
Step 2: using someones love for them
Gina - Genie
Rumple - Cora? (this is strongly suggested but we won't know for sure until The Millers Daughter. Even if it's not true Rumps has manipulated enough people to make up for it.)
Step 3: selfish love
Gina - Graham
Rumple - Milah
Step 4: selfless love again
Gina - yet to be determined (Gina hasn't found her "Belle" yet unless you count Henry who she let live with the Charming because he wasn't happy with her.)
Rumple - Belle A comment which I can very much agree to.
Just because we disagree with you doesn't mean we didn't read your comments. The above response was a pretty detailed response to your comment.
I already explained that to you; I picked Gina simply because there was no both are just as evil option, and I have voted on every pick on this spot thus far and don't plan on changing that, it is a very OCDish thing I have on fanpop. I do that on literally every spot I have a medal for. Even if the option I am looking for is missing I will vote and comment my true opinion. In fact I did that on the 'Which Captain Hook ship do you like' poll. And you say we don't ready your comments...
And I haven't said they are all the same either. I said they were similar that their actions and motives are similar. There is a considerable difference between being similar and being the same. To go along with my statements of how they are similar I can pinpoint how they are different. But we aren't discussing that therefore I have not done so, as I think it'd be irrelevant.
@claudia and stealing a mother's child because of some petty agreement he forced Cindy into isn't messed up? Cindy could've had her happy ending had Rumple not came in and exploded her fairy godmother. Exploding faeries is pretty messed up in itself.
"There is a considerable difference between being similar and being the same."
Exactly! They are incredibly similar though. A single episode could change my choice on this pick. Before The Doctor I would have picked Rumple and I could very easily go back with Gina doing evil again and Rumple having even more incentive to redeem himself.
@claudia_bb I got to agree with you on that one. That's pretty messed up. I often forget that one because they didn't make a big deal out of it. It was just a b-story in a filler episode that was never mentioned again. It's hard to think of something Rumple did that was equally bad killing the mute girl is pretty close I guess. Honestly I just sort of picked on a whim. Now I'm thinking I should have just abstained. They really are terrible people and neither is really better then the other.
Again: can we please talk about WHAT HAPPENED and not about what we've read in a fan-fiction? For all I know Cora used Rumps and abused his true love! Or if you imagine one day gina will learn what selfless love is one day I too can say Rumps is going to have the Dark One Curse broken one day and he'll become the philanthropic person he once was again, that he'll do no harm anymore and be the sweetest husband, father & grandfather that ever was. But I thought we're talking about NOW. About the point our characters reached now, due to past influence.
And how's wanting to adopt a child equal to feeding tens (maybe hundreds) of children to a carnivorous witch? When you're talking about gina adopting Henry in a very shady way you're all like: she's his mother! What does this show has against adoption? etc.
Mr. gold wanted to adopt Cindy's baby. Not feed him to a witch.
Well for onething he stole the child from someone else; he loves to make deals in babies who knows how many he stole. And who got her Henry? Mr. Gold did, that's what makes it 'shady'. Can we talk about what we've seen in the show and not fanfiction? We don't know what Mr. Gold wanted the babies for or how many he took.
Yes, what we've saw: we saw Mr. Gold wanting to adopt a baby. We saw gina sanding two children to a cannibal witch, and we've learned that she had send many-many others to their death in the same way.
So.. yeah -> Mr. Gold and his unfulfilled desire to adopt a baby.
and --------> Gina killing tens of children.
I think your the one making assumption now @Princess. We don't know Rumple ever wanted to adopt the babies he takes. If he had he would have adopted Charming's brother James when he took him from there mother. I think he just wants the babies to trade favors with powerful people who desperately want children, like King George.
Again we have no clue what he wanted another person's baby for. I doubt it was just to adopt it. And if that's the case, why did he have to take it from Cindy? Why couldn't he adopt one from an orphanage?
@minervadawn you're making assumptions too. And mine are more close to reality based on what we know about Rumps and his love for children (he originally wanted the powers so that he could stop a war that was killing thousand of children.
why not adopt from an orphanage? well... because HE COULD NOT LEAVE Storybrooke at that time. Duh!
Again: when it comes to Mr. Gold and Cindy's baby all you/I have are assumptions. A fact would be that Rumps saved the life of thousands of children by ending that war.
and a FACT is that gina killed tens, maybe thousands of children.
Yes, but others (as seen by August and that new guy (forgot his name) can come into Storybrook. He could've gave them a call requesting they dorm the child off at the Storybrook line where he'd be waiting. He's not stupid, if he wanted to adopt the legal way he could've found a way. So that 'duh' is a little out of place.
Okay what about after the war? Where he used his magic to harm innocents? Like that man who accidentally hurt Bae. Bae begged Gold not to hurt the guy but he did anyways. How many times did things like that occur? I would say a lot seeing as he was feared by most everyone and his own son was calling him a monster and trying so disparately to remove the Dark One curse. Those are not assumptions.
A fact is that Gold has killed tens of humans. Obviously murdering children is bad but its equally as bad to kill anyone else of any age. And to say she killed 1000's of kids is a huge exaggeration.
I'm pretty sure Rumps is the one who got Henry for Gina. This is of corse something of an assumption, but early in season 1 Gina asked Rumple have a conversation about Henry's adoption and it sounded like he was involved. If he brought Henry into storybrook why couldn't he get a child for himself? And again why didn't he adopt James when he took him from Ruth? The facts just don't point to him wanting to adopt a child.
My comments do say: "Another reason why, though also a bad guy, Gold is a better person than gina". Do you people even read my comments? I never said Rumps is a good person, just that he's better than gina.
@ magichand, you only see what you want in OUAT, right? And I can't believe that evil regals said dearies forget Rum's bad deeds. Sheesh! Talking about double standards.
I guess getting Henry to Storybrooke had something to do with him being the son of the Savior. He is special.
When did anyone say Gina was a good person? The only thing anyone has said is that she wasn't worse then Gold. None of us are denying that they have both done some pretty dispicable things. They are both bad people. How you pick depends completely on which of their redeeming qualities you value most. We're never going to agree because we all see things differently.
I still don't think Gold ever wanted to adopt a child. I don't think he intended to hurt them either, but if he wanted a child for himself he had plenty of opertunites to take one.
I didn't want to pick sides. I'm biased, since I'm a Rumbeller, but I honestly believe they're equal. Both of them became bad for sufficient reasons- he did it to protect his son and she became that way due to circumstances. Plus, her mother was a complete and total heartless bitch. Yet Rumple suffered before becoming the Dark One, and he remained a good person through that.
He grew up without a father and was raised by widows. His wife abandoned him and their son for some pretty boy pirate. He would have lost Bae if he hadn't become so desperate. Prior to becoming the Dark One, Rumple wasn't even bad. The worst thing he did was flee the war, and that was so Bae wouldn't be born fatherless.
Regina, on the other hand, led a pretty privileged life. She was born into royalty, and her father loved her dearly, as she did him. The only hindrance was Cora. And besides, even before she became wholly evil, she thought of killing Snow White. She also agreed with Rumple to get rid of her mother, and only invested in dark magic because it felt good. When she asked Rumple if she would become like Cora, he told her that was for her to decide. Yes, Rumple did push her in that direction, but all he's done since becoming the Dark One was to find Bae again. Regina set the curse to bring pain upon everyone, even innocents she had no contact with.
They're both gray, if you ask me. They've both done terrible things, yet underneath it all they're good. That's what I like about this show; it gives so much depth to the two dimensional characters that we knew from the books and films as children.
Just to name two:
1. he is in fact a good person, but he is cursed (the curse of the Dark One). as seen, before he actually got the powers he wanted them so that he could end the Ogre Wars and innocent people die no more.
2. even as the Dark One, he created the curse out of love, for the thing he loved the most: his son. Gina on the other hand caste the curse out of love for herself, because she wanted to be happy, and in her egoism even killed the thing she loved the most, her father, to be happy.
There's also the fact that he was around longer as the dark one, which gave him plenty more time to do those little evil deeds.Such as turning men into bugs, exploding faeries, beating the crap out of people, and destroying shops.
Despite Belle begging him to stop he continued to violently beat Hook and destroy all the things in his shop and many other things.
And let's not forget, he looked like he was gonna beat Emma to if Neal hadn't shown up.
I agree with zanhar1, lets not forget that Rumple had a hand in pushing Regina into her darkened spiral of revenge.
Just one more reason - out of the hundreds- why, though also a bad guy, Gold is a better person than gina:
3. He used his powers to do good too. As in stopping the Ogre Wars. And that came out of his soul, and not because he wanted to impress somebody.
(SORRY MY CAPS LOCK IS STUCK IT WON''T COME OFF LOL)
I know right. People set up these huge double standards, not just on this site either. And deny that hey do. Rumple and Gina have both done some pretty crappy things. Both have also done really good things. For instance, Snow wouldn't even be alive now if not for Gina; she save Snow twice (once when Cora hexed her horse and once when Rumple put a killing curse on the portal they were about to come through).
Another reason for which Gold, though also a bad guy, is a better person:
4. He does good deeds and does not boost about it, nor switch back to evil mode in one second just because the others don't rush to acknowledge his merits.
Like the fact that he gave the amulet to Henry, willing to pay himself the price for such powerful magic. And when the next day the Charmings with no proof at all came and accused him of murdering Archie he didn't go all evil and vengeful, but treated them with humor ^_^
Her and Gold are much the same. Many people say he's better because he is ''The Beast'' in a story, well he is no better then The Evil Queen.
That's why i picked Regina.
when you don't have arguments "bla" is all you can say.
I see this character in all his beautiful subtlety. He's fascinating. ->
I think Regina is better villain, because i've seen her in action many times (casting a curse, traveling to Wonderland, tricking people and now searching for a dagger) and also resembless to disney version of EQ.
Gina doesn't boast about her good deeds. Neither of them do. Perhaps Rumple never went back to being evil in one second because he never truly started on his road to redemption either. People say Gina wasn't really trying because she had only told Henry she was sorry (which is not true she apologized to Emma as well), well I haven't heard Gold say sorry to anyone but Belle. He never even vocally confirmed that he was trying to change. Another point I would like to make is that Gina didn't flop back to the evil side because her deeds went unacknowledged, (maybe such was a factor) but the reason she went back to being evil is because she was accused of murder, with that false accusation she may as well have still been evil. Gold didn't go all evil because he was able to prove he wasn't the killer, and his mother did not frame him. Again he didn't go evil again because he still hasn't really begun his road to redemption in the first place, by the standards you seem to hold for Gina anyways. Those standards being; Gina doesn't want to be good she just wants Henry, well Gold doesn't want to be good or give up magic he just wants Belle. And Gina isn't trying to be good because she only apologized to Henry and not the others she hurt. Same goes for Gold, he only apologized to Belle.
Not to mention almost killing Snow and Emma isn't exactly what someone on the good side would do. Nor is beating the crap out of Hook (though he had it coming) either. And at least Gina was able to hold out on her promise to Henry not to use magic (Gold couldn't manage that for Belle).
That is probably why it's so much easier to write off Rumps evil deeds then Gina's. He is who he is and he doesn't pretend to be any thing other than evil. He never make promises he cant keep (except to Belle and Bae) and he's always clear about the price for his services from the start. All this gives the impression that anyone that becomes involved with him and knows who he is are just asking for it. Gina is less strait forward in her evilness she gets people to trust her and then she turns on them. It feels more personal and less like business.
Still I don't think being more truthful about your evil intentions necessarily makes you a better person. That's like saying a mob boss is a better person then a con-man. They are both bad people. Anyway I picked Gina because she honestly tried to change. Rumple is trying too but it never felt like he was trying quite as hard as Gina was; he was still using magic, he never showed regret for what he had done in the past, ect.
Again, exactly, In fact I would think it makes him more evil, as it almost creates a sense that he takes pride in his evils. Which is backed by the fact that he uses his magic to make people fear him, which is pretty much taking pride in an evil action he committed. And once again well put, I agree.
Rumple was cursed.
Regina made an actual attempt to change and redeem herself.
Rumple originally the Dark One to stop the Ogre Wars so Bae wouldn't have to go fight.
Regina originally started working with Rumple to protect herself from her mother, and to find a way to bring Daniel back.
Rumple being cursed only excuses so much of his behavior.
Regina's pain only excuses so much of her behavior.
If I actually sat down and tallied it all up, and then scratched off certain tallies for certain excuses, they'd actually come out pretty even.
link
and it was very close. (Scroll to the bottom if you just want the summery)
5. Rumps went from selfless love to selfish love (he preferred to rip Milah's heart better than to let her be happy with Hook after all she had done to him), then again to SELFLESS love (As seen first in Skin Deep -> he would rather let Belle go, though he loved her, than keep her next to him - because he thought he could not make her happy).
On the other hand gina went from love (Daniel) to taking advantages and abusing others love for her (like Sidney) to selfish love (she would rather rip Graham's heart out than let him be happy with the one he loved).
so, Gold evolved to good, gina just went from bad to worse considering this aspect. Again, Gold, though also a bad guy, is better than the one he's compared to.
Step 1: selfless love
Gina - Daniel
Rumple - Milah
Step 2: using someones love for them
Gina - Genie
Rumple - Cora? (this is strongly suggested but we won't know for sure until The Millers Daughter. Even if it's not true Rumps has manipulated enough people to make up for it.)
Step 3: selfish love
Gina - Graham
Rumple - Milah
Step 4: selfless love again
Gina - yet to be determined (Gina hasn't found her "Belle" yet unless you count Henry who she let live with the Charming because he wasn't happy with her.)
Rumple - Belle
Related to my previous reason: I see people don't really care about Graham. In as counting him as 'love' for gina. Then if she killed a guy she was just having sex with because he found somebody who loved him, and whom he loved... than makes her even a worse person.
And let's not bring Cora in yet. From what I've got out of Rose's description of her character it was that sort of relationship in which they've both used each other. So let's not talk without knowing.
Another reason why, though also a bad guy, Gold is a better person than gina:
5. He didn't kill anyone in his Storybrooke life, as Mr. Gold.
gina killed Graham.
Counting Graham is Gina's lover is not, not careing about Graham. He was a love intrest for her until Emma came into the picture. In Storybrook it is a fact that Graham agreed to have sex with her (as shown when he came to her house that night, kissing her, claiming 'I need to feel something'). Again with the double standards; Rumple clearly had sex with Milah (considering Bae is alive) and he had no problem ripping her heart out when she found someone who loved her, and that she loved back. It's the same thing both Gold and Gina were cheated on and both gave the same response. They are equally as bad in that light. Not one murder is worse than another. And in this case not one is more 'justifiable' than the other, as it was the exact same thing (motives and way of murder in all). So if that makes Gina a worse person, what does the very same action make Rumple?
But it's still a possibility. Gold and Cora did have some relationship and I would not be surprised at all if it was just based on Rumple's plan to find his son and not true love.
Not true, in his Storybrook life he had attempted to kill three people; Hook, Snow, and Emma. The only reason he didn't was because someone was there to inter-vine each time. If Belle didn't tell him to stop he would've beat Hook to death. If Regina didn't absorb the curse he cast on the well Snow and Emma'd be gone as well. In fact he tried to kill (or at least harm) Emma again, who knows what would've happened if Neal didn't barge in. The only thing that kept him from murder in Storybrook were people butting in. As a side note turned Smee into a mouse (I think it was a mouse), pushed him over the border, and threatened his life on multiple occasions.
Another reason why, though also a bad guy, Gold is a better person than gina:
6. He's a fair person, he always keeps his deals. He doesn't double-cross everyone like gina.
He defiantly didn't double cross Bae when he let him fall to New York. And it clearly wasn't double crossing Regina when he helped Emma prove Snow innocent despite assuring Regina that he'd make sure Snow was gonna be found guilty.
As Mr. Gold said from the moment he lost Bae he never failed to keep another deal. That was a turning point in his life. It changed him forever. Because he's complex like that: he learns from past mistakes.
Another reason why, though also a bad guy, Gold is a better person than gina:
7.Rumps didn't send kids to their deaths. It takes a special kind of awful to do stuff like that. I don’t know how anyone could reach the point where feeding kids to a cannibal doesn't bother them at all.
And he killed his ex wife and Bae's mother (doesn't matter how bitchy she was, no one deserves that), he wanted for Regina to lose her soul (that is worse then death), also he killed his female servent and he killed Cionderella's godmother and that guy he 1st turned into snail.
Not to mention he turned Regina evil... For God sake, it wasn't Regina's fault becasue he lost his son. It was his. Really curios how Bae will react when he hears about these actions.
HE IS NO BETTER !
Rumple had treated the seer pretty unkindly when she was a caged up little girl he got mad at her for speaking the truth and started yelling at her and what not. Gold tried to steal Cindy's baby, it takes a special kind of awful to steal an unborn baby in both Storybrook and Fairytale land. Gold could've found Hansel and Gretel a home as he was the landlord of Storybrook, he chose not to. Again both committed the same evil but in a different way.
And as magichand bought up; he wanted to rip Regina's soul away. I don't know if you are similar with Harry Potter, but in that world losing one's soul is considered worse than death itself. Gina never tried to steal someone's soul.
seriously... if you don't even read my comments.. at least don't reply to them.
and if you all say they're the same: why pick gina as better? I don't see you with no variant chosen - because you can't make the difference between them. you still picked gina.
and don't get it all on me :) I didn't make this pick ^_^
Step 1: selfless love
Gina - Daniel
Rumple - Milah
Step 2: using someones love for them
Gina - Genie
Rumple - Cora? (this is strongly suggested but we won't know for sure until The Millers Daughter. Even if it's not true Rumps has manipulated enough people to make up for it.)
Step 3: selfish love
Gina - Graham
Rumple - Milah
Step 4: selfless love again
Gina - yet to be determined (Gina hasn't found her "Belle" yet unless you count Henry who she let live with the Charming because he wasn't happy with her.)
Rumple - Belle A comment which I can very much agree to.
Just because we disagree with you doesn't mean we didn't read your comments. The above response was a pretty detailed response to your comment.
I already explained that to you; I picked Gina simply because there was no both are just as evil option, and I have voted on every pick on this spot thus far and don't plan on changing that, it is a very OCDish thing I have on fanpop. I do that on literally every spot I have a medal for. Even if the option I am looking for is missing I will vote and comment my true opinion. In fact I did that on the 'Which Captain Hook ship do you like' poll. And you say we don't ready your comments...
And I haven't said they are all the same either. I said they were similar that their actions and motives are similar. There is a considerable difference between being similar and being the same. To go along with my statements of how they are similar I can pinpoint how they are different. But we aren't discussing that therefore I have not done so, as I think it'd be irrelevant.
@claudia and stealing a mother's child because of some petty agreement he forced Cindy into isn't messed up? Cindy could've had her happy ending had Rumple not came in and exploded her fairy godmother. Exploding faeries is pretty messed up in itself.
Exactly! They are incredibly similar though. A single episode could change my choice on this pick. Before The Doctor I would have picked Rumple and I could very easily go back with Gina doing evil again and Rumple having even more incentive to redeem himself.
And how's wanting to adopt a child equal to feeding tens (maybe hundreds) of children to a carnivorous witch? When you're talking about gina adopting Henry in a very shady way you're all like: she's his mother! What does this show has against adoption? etc.
Mr. gold wanted to adopt Cindy's baby. Not feed him to a witch.
Well for onething he stole the child from someone else; he loves to make deals in babies who knows how many he stole. And who got her Henry? Mr. Gold did, that's what makes it 'shady'. Can we talk about what we've seen in the show and not fanfiction? We don't know what Mr. Gold wanted the babies for or how many he took.
So.. yeah -> Mr. Gold and his unfulfilled desire to adopt a baby.
and --------> Gina killing tens of children.
why not adopt from an orphanage? well... because HE COULD NOT LEAVE Storybrooke at that time. Duh!
Again: when it comes to Mr. Gold and Cindy's baby all you/I have are assumptions. A fact would be that Rumps saved the life of thousands of children by ending that war.
and a FACT is that gina killed tens, maybe thousands of children.
Okay what about after the war? Where he used his magic to harm innocents? Like that man who accidentally hurt Bae. Bae begged Gold not to hurt the guy but he did anyways. How many times did things like that occur? I would say a lot seeing as he was feared by most everyone and his own son was calling him a monster and trying so disparately to remove the Dark One curse. Those are not assumptions.
A fact is that Gold has killed tens of humans. Obviously murdering children is bad but its equally as bad to kill anyone else of any age. And to say she killed 1000's of kids is a huge exaggeration.
@ magichand, you only see what you want in OUAT, right? And I can't believe that evil regals said dearies forget Rum's bad deeds. Sheesh! Talking about double standards.
I guess getting Henry to Storybrooke had something to do with him being the son of the Savior. He is special.
I still don't think Gold ever wanted to adopt a child. I don't think he intended to hurt them either, but if he wanted a child for himself he had plenty of opertunites to take one.
Another reason why, though also a bad guy, Gold is a better person than gina:
He didn't rape anyone.
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I haven't started this pick. I HAVEN'T CAUSED THIS.
I still have reasons for my pick. But as long as I'm not challenged I won't comment anymore.
He grew up without a father and was raised by widows. His wife abandoned him and their son for some pretty boy pirate. He would have lost Bae if he hadn't become so desperate. Prior to becoming the Dark One, Rumple wasn't even bad. The worst thing he did was flee the war, and that was so Bae wouldn't be born fatherless.
Regina, on the other hand, led a pretty privileged life. She was born into royalty, and her father loved her dearly, as she did him. The only hindrance was Cora. And besides, even before she became wholly evil, she thought of killing Snow White. She also agreed with Rumple to get rid of her mother, and only invested in dark magic because it felt good. When she asked Rumple if she would become like Cora, he told her that was for her to decide. Yes, Rumple did push her in that direction, but all he's done since becoming the Dark One was to find Bae again. Regina set the curse to bring pain upon everyone, even innocents she had no contact with.
They're both gray, if you ask me. They've both done terrible things, yet underneath it all they're good. That's what I like about this show; it gives so much depth to the two dimensional characters that we knew from the books and films as children.
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